Custom top triple tree?

Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 2:26 pm

For those of you that have made or have had made top triples could you give me a few details? Who machined them for you? Did you design or someone else? What was the cost? I'm going to be using conventional cartridge forks from a '99 cbr. I have a friend that can easily draw up a design in SW but he's done several other projects with me so far and I dont want to wear out my welcome. I may still ask him and then source a shop to do the machine work but not sure what I should expect for price?

Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 3:26 pm

If nothing else you could probably get some pricing guidelines from these guys.
Some nice looking bits.
http://www.customtripletrees.com/TREES/HONDA/honda.html

Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 4:28 pm

I've used these guys for some other bikes. They do a nice clean top triple. All you do is send in yours if they don't already have your bike spec'd and they will create a new one. They added a few more styles since I've last seen. Look around their site under triple tree, to see if they have anything you are looking for. If you have specs, they can probably add it. 1'' rise, offset etc.

https://cognitomoto.com/collections/triple-clamps_handlebars_controls/products/custom-made-billet-triple-clamp

Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 5:29 pm

I had a custom triple made by bullitcustomcycles for my stock 37mm fork tubes. Including the riser bushings, the total was $111 (CAD$140). Took two tries to get a triple that fit and I did have to send them the stock component. Still, for the price, the end product was quite nice.

http://bullitcustomcycles.com/

Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2016 8:20 pm

If you do use cognito moto you may have to wait a bit. They were a little behind on orders and it took two months to get my custom stem made.

CB1100F Joined: Feb 17, 2009 Posts: 2105 Location: Oz

nathanhouse wrote:

For those of you that have made or have had made top triples could you give me a few details? Who machined them for you? Did you design or someone else? What was the cost? I'm going to be using conventional cartridge forks from a '99 cbr. I have a friend that can easily draw up a design in SW but he's done several other projects with me so far and I dont want to wear out my welcome. I may still ask him and then source a shop to do the machine work but not sure what I should expect for price?

My brother made mine. He's making parts for customers. If you're interested to know more let me know.

Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2016 1:35 am

I've looked at cognito but haven't talked to them yet. I like their stuff!

Don, pm sent.

Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2016 3:00 pm

Did I quote a set for you a while back?

Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2016 3:24 pm

SEBSPEED wrote:

Did I quote a set for you a while back?

Don't think so... I'm just starting to mess with the suspension now. I've had some of the parts for a while but they have just been sitting till now.

Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2016 3:54 pm

hey nathanhouse where you able to use the information I gave you for the rearsets

Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2016 3:59 pm

nugget wrote:

hey nathanhouse where you able to use the information I gave you for the rearsets

I did! Had one side 3d printed so I could do some mock up. Going to modify the rear master mounting location and a couple other small things but it worked great!

Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 5:41 pm

Another question for you guys that know more about this stuff than me:
Are the fork holes in the top tree parallel (that is on the same angle) as the hole for the stem? I may just design my own but this is one place I don't want to get wrong and I honestly don't know the answer.

CB1100F Joined: Feb 17, 2009 Posts: 2105 Location: Oz

nathanhouse wrote:

Are the fork holes in the top tree parallel (that is on the same angle) as the hole for the stem?

Yes.

Posted: Sun Jul 10, 2016 11:32 pm

DonR wrote:

nathanhouse wrote:

Are the fork holes in the top tree parallel (that is on the same angle) as the hole for the stem?

Yes.

Now the next question is are the cbr f4 also parallel? They look it.

Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 12:39 am

nathanhouse wrote:

DonR wrote:

nathanhouse wrote:

Are the fork holes in the top tree parallel (that is on the same angle) as the hole for the stem?

Yes.

Now the next question is are the cbr f4 also parallel? They look it.

Most of the sport bike type stuff is. You don't get those funky trees until you get into chopper style frames and they do it to drag the trail back into the useable range.

Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 1:15 am

That's kinda what I thought but I wanted to ask since I want sure. I've heard of mx bikes doing this too.

Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 2:07 am

Both bikes have zero rake built into the trees.

I can do a basic set for around $500. I build them to your specs: fork diameter, offset, riser placement, etc around your stem. Can do a drop top for a bit extra.

I have pics hosted on my Facebook page if you'd like to have a look. (SebspeedCustoms)

I have done a few sets for members here and more than a dozen for others around the globe, for all sorts of bikes from modern sport machines to mx bikes and old school resto mods.

Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 2:44 am

Whatever you do............ Make sure you understand very clearly the trail you are wanting as the rake sets the start point and the offset then dictates the trail. If you want to know how to visualise this so you make no mistake, draw it on the wall full size and you will see right in front of your eyes.

When starting from the OEM rake of the "F" (27.5-28.5 degree) and installing later generational forks complete with triples (which have lesser offset) you are increasing the trail and so slowing the steering. It is stiffer and better performing as far as damping etc goes but you are going backwards on steering input. Typically you need more offset to restore this or even more to speed it up.
I don't know how many bikes I have seen over the years where this been done incorrectly but it's a lot.

Captain

CB1100F Joined: Feb 17, 2009 Posts: 2105 Location: Oz

Nathan, the CBR600F4 runs 30mm of offset on the triple clamps. If you run a 120x60/17 tyre you'll end up with 120mm of trail which is very heavy. I used the stock CB900 offset of 40mm which gives a nice balance of steering effort and stability on the road.

Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 10:33 am

Thanks guys! This is exactly the kind of info that I need! So, since the offset from the cbr may make me an unhappy F rider I guess I won't be using the bottom tree after all but make both top and bottom.
One more reason I love this site and the people on it.

CB1100F Joined: Feb 17, 2009 Posts: 2105 Location: Oz

Not necessarily unhappy but be prepared for an upper body workout! Go to http://www.tonyfoale.com and click on the freeware tab. Download the steering geometry applet and have a play around. Lots of other cool things on the page to play with.

Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 12:27 pm

On the Spencer tribute bike I just built for my customer I had custom billet triples made with 40mm offset and 210mm fork spacing. I set the rear swingarm angle at 12.5 degrees. In the final configuration with 17 inch wheels (120/70-17 front and 180/55-17 rear) I ended up with 95mm of trail. The bike is very nimble and feels nicely balanced.

I had victorpeters1974 of this site help out with the solid works drawing for the triples (adding my preferred dimensions) and then had Mirko Zanzani (ivan_the_terrible's brother) machine them for me. The goal was to look as close as possible to the original AHM superbike clamps.

Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 1:07 pm

DonR wrote:

Not necessarily unhappy but be prepared for an upper body workout! Go to http://www.tonyfoale.com and click on the freeware tab. Download the steering geometry applet and have a play around. Lots of other cool things on the page to play with.

thanks usefull stuff on there

CB1100F Joined: Feb 17, 2009 Posts: 2105 Location: Oz

petrat wrote:

On the Spencer tribute bike I just built for my customer I had custom billet triples made with 40mm offset and 210mm fork spacing. I set the rear swingarm angle at 12.5 degrees. In the final configuration with 17 inch wheels (120/70-17 front and 180/55-17 rear) I ended up with 95mm of trail. The bike is very nimble and feels nicely balanced.

Darren can tell Nathan what running a 30mm offset feels like! Do I recall correctly that the RC51 triples on your Evolution were 30mm?

Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:29 am

Yes, RC triples are 30mm. Keep in mind when using shorter forks, the offset should shrink to suit.

I am using a 35mm offset on my 900 with 900RR forks, and it feels quite nice.

Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:30 pm

DonR wrote:

petrat wrote:

On the Spencer tribute bike I just built for my customer I had custom billet triples made with 40mm offset and 210mm fork spacing. I set the rear swingarm angle at 12.5 degrees. In the final configuration with 17 inch wheels (120/70-17 front and 180/55-17 rear) I ended up with 95mm of trail. The bike is very nimble and feels nicely balanced.

Darren can tell Nathan what running a 30mm offset feels like! Do I recall correctly that the RC51 triples on your Evolution were 30mm?

Correct, the RC51/CBR954 triples are 30mm offset. The black Evo bike with the RC51 forks was set almost the same with 12 degrees swingarm angle (swingarm was about 20mm longer). Because I was using a step down triple on the black bike my effective fork length was the same as what I am using now with the conventional OHLINS on the Spencer Tribute. Same wheel and tire sizes. It is crazy what 10mm of offset makes in the handling and how light the steering feels dropping it into a corner. When I was running the numbers by Captain he indicated that 95mm of trail is a good number and right on the edge of where a steering damper is an absolute necessity.

Twinstar Joined: Sep 02, 2013 Posts: 114 Location: Texas

So based on the info available on this site and the interwebs running USD forks requires offset in the triple trees in order to provide a proper trail measurement. This is excellent information. My question then becomes what is a good target range in terms of trail measurement. Darren stated that 95mm is good but on the edge of a required damper. I have read that 3 to 5 inches is good. But I havent installed USD forks on a Cb750 before and dont know what measurement range to shoot for. Simply bolting up a USD front end seems to be gambling on trail measurement. Anyone running USD forks have results and a good range for trail measurement?

Posted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:11 pm

Its already been stated.......... 95 mm is the mark and is on the lower edge and that requires a damper. This is a minimum figure in my experience with these bikes. But it will provide quick steering which is what this is all about but at high speed the damper becomes important to control any "head shake" when transitioning direction and encountering heavy load change at the same time (For those that have been there and a perfect example is at the bottom of eau rouge Spa-Francorchamps)
Any increase of trail above this figure (95 mm) slows and increases the weighting (makes it heavier) of the steering. Anything above 105mm I regard as "Truck like" and is heavy and slow.

Captain

Twinstar Joined: Sep 02, 2013 Posts: 114 Location: Texas

Thanks for the insight. Much appreciated.

Posted: Wed Jul 26, 2017 12:23 am

I wanted jump in here since I am looking for a custom set of billet triple clamps.

Here is what I have found so far.

Ripple Rock Racers: They will get back to me around August 1st.
http://www.ripplerockracers.com

Darren: Love your work and thanks for the referral. Unfortunately the both of you have busy schedules.

DonR and his brother Mario: Love your brothers work. Unfortunately, I live in the USA Sad

bill@customtripletrees:
Nice guy and willing to take on the project. Not sure if he clearly understand what the end results needs be since he was looking to increase the suggested offset.

Bullit Motorcycle Works - How do you contact them outside of Facebook Page?

Devin Henriques @ www.CognitoMoto.com
Waiting for clarification on what exactly they can do. CB1100F you will need to send your stock triple in since they don't have the specs on file.

Hopefully this will be helpful.