Did the Cycle World article piss anyone else off?

Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 8:32 pm

With all the beautiful bikes here Cycle World goes and prints an article where a guy makes a Freddie Spencer replica with a frigging Suzuki 1157 Bandit motor.

Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 8:48 pm

Owner has posted here before >>>> http://www.cb1100f.net/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=55038&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=20

Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 8:53 pm

Yeah, it's hard to get mad at that bike...

Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2011 11:52 pm

Not at all, it is a beautiful bike.

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 12:03 am

Piss me off? No. Do I think it is pretty AND silly at the same time? Yes!

CB1100F Joined: Feb 17, 2009 Posts: 2105 Location: Oz

I'm with you DrOlds. It's an abomination.

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 1:27 am

Just a thought.... do you think maybe the person (who most likely was born in the last 20 years) did not realize that the motor was not Honda?

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 1:44 am

I already took the line out of the artical about the Honda engine being fragile and the factory having problems keeping them together.

Did a nice job sneaking the Suzuki motor in.

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 2:09 am

There is no question more power can be made with modern technology (motors) but the 1100 can be made reliable and if you want vintage race tech and look why not showcase some of the beautiful bikes we have here. It just pisses me off that a national mag with the cycle world coverage prints that when we have nicer bikes here. Doc

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 3:04 am

Nope not even close.

I can tell you I spent gobs of money,the GSXR was a road race bike to start with. The Bandit was just another use for the original engine after the later GSXR water cooled came out. 1157cc and stock vs 1187cc as large as you can sleeve it on this Honda,absolute max at 1252cc.

Power wise the GSXR is a lot faster no matter what you do to the Honda. They have bore center spacing to make them big I mean great BIG. Several people have put GSXR heads onto the GS crankcase. There is suppose to be flow advantage. I just never built any Suzukis just raced against them. I can tell you that there is more cylinder to cylinder spacing,ie head gasket strength on a GS at 1500cc than this Honda has at 1200cc. A few guys have built the GS up to 1700cc. So I think Suzuki just kept the same spacing on all the models.

This Honda may have been OK in the 80's when the aftermarket made parts,but the GSXR still has stuff made for it and you do not need the special handshake to get them.

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 3:48 am

I wonder if the Bandit guys are pissed someone wrapped a Honda around their engine? Laughing

I think it's a cool bike, well done, and deserved to be published. I'm an F fan like the rest of you, but it's hard to deny that there have been better engines built since 1983. It might be one thing if the guy had put a GS1100E motor in an F bike, that's straight 1981 tech replacing 1981 tech, but the Bandit motor is just a newer, updated design that provides more reliable power with less weight in a compact package.

To be fair, the pic on the home page features an F with RC-51 forks, it that OK because it's a Honda part? What about all the guys running GSXR carbs? Is that OK? Let's face it, a lot of what we do is tinker, and try to put things together that were never meant to go together. Sometimes it's Honda/Honda, sometimes it's Honda/other-brand. In the end, the guy clearly could have built anything he wanted, and when he set his sights on a kick-ass bike, he wanted it to look like an F. Seems like a compliment to me.

CB1100F Joined: Feb 17, 2009 Posts: 2105 Location: Oz

it's like trying to make a walrus look
like a supermodel though. It just ain't natural....

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 12:28 pm

I think it is great. Ive seen it before on here. Now that I have a couple of suzis & have been riding them, I can honestly say they are great bikes. Fast too. My 82 1100E rips. I think it will beat a stock 11F. I will find out soon. I will race Stetler before the snow flies.

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 2:56 pm

no. it's hike. I like it. mine is opposite, Honda motor with suzi front, swingarm and body. I look in the mirror and i don't look like i did 30 years ago either. It's natural for change to occure.

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 3:38 pm

Read the Moto Retro article under the Premix tab titled Retro Superbike, The Freddie Rep, it will make you feel better.

Issue #5, Summer 2011

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 4:25 pm

I think we are all just trying to express our ideas, and maybe our abilities to a certain extent when restoring or customising a bike or car. To the purists I can understand their dislike, but I dont think it should detract from what it is. I love it... Its an old bike that looks fantastic, probably rides worlds better than stock, and is still on the road....You have plenty people building 30's and 40's hot rods with motors from recent years or different manufacturers, and thats accepted..Respect for what he's achieved...If I could have my F like that, I would be more than happy..you can see it here on youtube..http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiibakWw8wY

Fonz...

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 6:20 pm

Next up for me, Fonz, a bike that looks pretty much like yours. I have all the ingrediants but time.

Twinstar Joined: Aug 27, 2011 Posts: 38 Location: Norway

Novemeber 1979........I was in daipers/nappies for the first time nearly a year after the first Doch CB came out, so maybe I don't have a say in this (if your nodding your head now your an old fart that needs to rethink the way the world spin)

This bike works for me, he's taken the road he thought was best, loads of power in a sweet looking chassi that looks mega, wicked and I would love to have one parked in my garage. My 5 cents anyway

Posted: Sat Oct 08, 2011 9:11 pm

You know if you all had read the article....the only Honda parts on this thing are the tank, sidecovers, and tail....
every last part with the exception of the motor is custom....
To me it is a compliment.....he could have put any bodywork on this thing.....but he chose to put the best looking pieces...albeit the most identifiable....of the eighties on this machine.....
My favorite part is the $3000 dash that says "Hello Freddie" when you turn the key on....
Think of this as a tribute.
The only reason he used the Suzuki motor is because it was the most refined motor that had fins.
To me it is pure art......kudos to Cycle Word for printing an article on something very different.

Jebby

Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 12:33 am

In the past how many customs,like the Norvin,Vincent engine in Norton frame,or the Triton,Triumph engine in Norton frame were done often enough they actually got named?

Bottom line is Honda only made this engine for 4 years,79 as 750 to 83 as 1100. The GSXR air/oil cooled one started in 1985 finally becoming the Bandit only recently getting a dedicated new designed engine in 2007. Basically 20 years worth of all manner of stroke lengths and bore sizes in the air/oil cooled motor.

Starting as a race bike,with Suzuki cup race classes vs Honda who gave up on it in 4 years.

Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 2:42 am

Sonic since you're giving history lessons here's a little tidbit most people aren't aware of.

The CBX and CB1100F were both being developed side by side in 1976, after several years of development Mr. Honda and the engineering teams decided to launch the CBX as their flagship bike and shelved the fully developed CB1100F.

The CB1100F was based on Honda's CBR 1000 endurance racer of the day but Honda wanted something different to release to the public and thus went with the CBX.

After the CBX was put to sleep in 82 Honda dusted off the CB1100F and released it as a stop gap because the VF's V4 motors were not developed enough to release, the reason the CB1100F was only a one year production model.

Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:20 am

Yes I had read that as well with most justification was like 5 Hp advantage for the 6.

Really odd looking at a CBX from the rear . An engine so wide to need caster wheels and a tire more suited for a bicycle.

I have ported CBX heads and lot of power lost there. The damn ports do not even line up with the valves,especially 1 and 6.

This is what makes me think the engine was developed first then put into a chassis. The 4 cylinder heads also look like a trig error. Cylinders are 3.150" apart,the carbs are 3.150" apart. Then somehow mislocated the ports to need a kink put in rubbers #2+3. The head bolts on cylinder 2 and 3 are closer to the ports and not the reason to move 1 and 4 .150" off location to the outside. They also made the head spigot smaller than the carbs.

I will bet they made the head spigot the carb size machined at a 10 degree angle to the head where it should be and they promptly exploded. So they came up with the solution they got to restrict the power till the "better",cough,cough,V-4's came out.

Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:40 am

Honda changed the head design mid development to create the V shape of the intake trac and carb rack so the riders knees would clear the airbox.

Thus the unequal intake runners, they compensated for that in the front of the airbox with offset manifolds but this didn't help the indirect airflow to the intake valves for #1 and 6 cylinders.

Heres what s friend of mine did to his CBX head to correct this condition. All this head work only gained him seven RWHP

Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:45 am

That guy race at Norwalk? If so I have seen that bike.

Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 3:51 am

sonicrete wrote:

That guy race at Norwalk? If so I have seen that bike.

Road raced in WERA, Nelson Ledges was his home road course.

Twinstar Joined: Aug 27, 2011 Posts: 38 Location: Norway

cbxsix wrote:

The CB1100F was based on Honda's CBR 1000 endurance racer of the day but Honda wanted something different to release to the public and thus went with the CBX.

Not RCB 1000 ??

Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 1:41 pm

speedyandypandy wrote:

cbxsix wrote:

The CB1100F was based on Honda's CBR 1000 endurance racer of the day but Honda wanted something different to release to the public and thus went with the CBX.

Not RCB 1000 ??

Not according to this letter from Shoichiro Irimajiri, an engineer on the design team for the CBX and the current VP of Honda USA at the time he wrote the letter. He did refer to the CB1100F as CB1000F but I just thought that was a typo, or it was developed as the CB1000F and morphed into the CB1100F before it was finally released in 1983.

I may have a chance to clear all this up in November, A friend of mine from Japan is a CBX and CB1100R club member there and his club is organizing a meeting and is inviting the Honda design team for the CB1100R, they will be interviewing them and also taping the meeting, the last time they did this for the CBX design team and he sent me that DVD.

I'm working with him now to get permission for me to solicit the members here for questions to submit during tthe meeting, I'll get back to the forum here if it works out.

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Twinstar Joined: Aug 27, 2011 Posts: 38 Location: Norway

Very nice, good going.

They must have been working on more then one bike then, the bike Ron Haslam won the Isle of Man TT 1982 was a RCB 1000, in fact it was only 999cc, and back then it was the latest from the factory built for the F1 championship.

Posted: Sun Oct 09, 2011 5:47 pm

I have received permission to submit questions from members here to the original CB1100F & R Honda development team during their meeting in November.

Please submit any questions you may have on the other thread I started titled, Opportunity of a lifetime Interview with CB1100F & R designers.

Submit questions HERE,
http://www.cb1100f.net/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=63795&highlight=

Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:20 pm

After reading both the article and this thread, What would be considered an acceptable motor to put into a CB frame? Assuming you ran across the perfect deal on the motor.

Travis