o-ring chain-v- non-o-ring chain

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2010 2:01 pm

Is a o-ring chain really that much better then a non-o-ring or should I say worth the additional cost?

random thoughts: Isn't a o-ring chain heavier then a non o-ring?

so if I have a non o-ring that just means I need to oil it more often?

Lets say, I only put on 4000 miles or less a year! How long does a good chain last? 10,000-12,000 miles?

I have my 1123cc more of a show bike, like I say only ride minimum mileage.

??????

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2010 3:23 pm

Hi ,I think that the O ring chain prevents from getting dirt in the inner chain,but you should oil it as well for the outside.
I would chose the O ring I guess,its probebly safer

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2010 3:45 pm

I went with a gold D.I.D X-ring chain alot better at keeping dirt out than an O-ring.If you cut an O-Ring, it has the cross section of an 'O', and if you cut an 'X' ring, it has the cross section of an 'X'.
The thinking behind the 'X' ring is it provides two sealing surfaces to keep the lubricant in the rollers while the 'O' ring only has one sealing surface. The 'X' ring is also supposed to have somewhat less resistance as the chain goes around the sprockets.

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2010 3:59 pm

here's an interesting write up to help you decide.
http://www.quality-cycle.com/truth_about_motorcycle_chains.htm

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2010 4:14 pm

I'd go X ring. In addition to GTO's comments, the sides of the X ring (more of a double box than and X) lies flat against the side of the link plates so it's harder for dirt to wedge itself in-between the sealing ring and the link plate (unlike an oring).

With a standard chain, you have to oil it all the time and the oil never gets to where it needs to be - in between the link pins and the rollers - that's where all the wear occurs. An "O" ring or "X" ring or I think there's even a "W" ring are all better (idealy) at keeping the factory installed pin/roller lube on the pins.

I just put an X ring on my 1100 and it's guaranteed (not that I fully believe it mind you) for 20k miles. Time will tell, but I think it's safe to say that i'll last a lot longer than a standard chain - especially at the rate that I oil my chains (which is about once a season Embarassed

).

Posted: Wed Sep 15, 2010 8:18 pm

Thank for posting that bee-jay, Im fixin to buy a chain and could'nt decide o-ring or x-ring . Now i know Cool

X-ring

Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2010 12:15 am

Tsubaki makes a decent low priced "O" ring chain.

The QR is a very good non "O" ring and you need to pour oil on it to get any life at all.

All it takes is one ride in the rain and a non "O" ring is junk. Most people will not do the WD-40 then reoil after getting home from a rain ride.

Now if you are drag racing they make a 10,000 lb non "O" ring 530 chain. This is basic 630 stength but this chain was $150 15 yrs ago.

Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2010 12:38 am

I copied a post from a couple of years ago (I asked Dennis Kirk tech which chain for my 1100 since they did not have one shown on a search by bike.) This was the reply:

hello, thanks for contacting us here at dennis kirk.
unfortunately there isn't a did chain that is strong enough for your model.
take a look at the following:
1983 Honda CB1100F
Stock Front Sprocket: 17
Stock Rear Sprocket: 42
Stock Chain: 530x104
Tsubaki
530 Sigma Series O-Ring Chain, 104 Links 11135104 $154.99
RK
GB530GXW Sealed Ring Chain, 104 Links 119363104 $194.99
have a good day,
rick

dennis kirk, inc.

I put them on both my bikes and I am satisfied.

Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2010 1:28 am

DrOlds wrote:

I asked Dennis Kirk tech which chain for my 1100 since they did not have one shown on a search by bike.) This was the reply:

hello, thanks for contacting us here at dennis kirk.
unfortunately there isn't a did chain that is strong enough for your model.
have a good day,
rick
dennis kirk, inc.
I put them on both my bikes and I am satisfied.

Thats funny here`s the info on my chain I don`t think my 1100 will hurt it.

D.I.D. 530ZVMX Super Street X'ring series chain available in either gold or nickel plated finish. This is one of the strongest chains on the market and now rated to 1400cc's. If your running big power, this is the chain you want. Tensile strength is 10,408 and the wear index rating is 4000.

Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2010 5:24 pm

I think I used the RK 530XSOZ1 (X Ring) on my 1100. Probably a bit light on the specifications (see specs below) at 9200 lbs tensile strength (or is that 'light'? - seems like a lot to me) but it's recommended for 1000 cc bikes and the newer 1000 cc bikes have a lot more HP than my old 11 (I know - the newer bikes are not as heavy) but I'm not 'pounding' the old 11 (much Laughing

) so I think I'll be OK with a bit 'lighter' chain (time will tell), and the price was right at about $120 at DK.

Here are the specs on the RK’s 530XSOZ1:
http://www.gpbikes.com/chart_image.asp?width=800&height=120&img=http%3A%2F%2Fcdn%2D5%2Epsndealer%2Ecom%2Fe2%2Fdealersite%2Fimages%2Fec0444%2Fpage%5F369%5Fimage%5F686411%2Ejpg

Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2010 6:00 pm

I put an x-ring chain on my 1100 last year and have around 10000 miles or so on it,lube it once a week and its still in great shape, worth the extra bucks I'd say
B.

Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2010 6:51 pm

I have the Tsubaki 530 Sigma Series O-Ring Chain with 17 and 45 tooth put wax on it ever 500 or so miles and am very happy with the results the wx is easy to get off the chain and if any gets on the rim you can't see it. Don't forget to change out the sprockets also. Check ebay for the stuff got a really good price on the chain I think 134 for the cahin

Posted: Thu Sep 16, 2010 7:32 pm

If you're concerned about looks then by all means go x ring. The only reason to oil an o or x ring chain is to keep the outside from rusting, so you you dont have to use much at all, which means less oil flinging all over the place. The only people not using them are race teams who are only concerned about having less drag, and replace their chains after every race. Wink

Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 12:14 am

Metal on metal needs oil Sprocket to chain no oil not good

Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 12:38 am

Since this came up.

The pin to bushing has the lube sealed in by the "O" ring. The roller to the bushing still needs lubed like any chain. Same for the contact of the roller to the sprockets.

You can buy spray motorcycle chain oil and pay big bucks. Better choice is to buy a gallon of Chain and Bar Oil for a chain saw. Then buy a Harbor Freight "forever" spray bottle. These refill and pressurise with shop air pressure.

If the oil will stay on a chain cutting tree limbs staying on a motor cycle drive chain is easy. Turns out this is the best bike chain oil I ever found. You can spray it on and hear the chain run quieter,does not fling off,and a gallon costs about $4.

Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 2:46 am

I went for the X-ring and I use chain wax in a can. Wax does not drip and splatter like other lubes. The downside for some is that it's harder to see but I lube the chain religiously so that's not a problem.

Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 3:45 am

Yes and the wax is a total waste of time to use.

Explain again. Wax is the OUTSIDE of the link to look pretty.

The chain needs oil to penetrate into the space between the roller and the bushing. It also needs oil at the sprocket teeth as a cushion. This is why it is called a roller chain.

I can take an "O" ring chain. Center stand,start the engine,put in gear. As you spray the oil on the chain it noticebly frees up and gets quieter.

Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 6:14 am

sonicrete wrote:

Yes and the wax is a total waste of time to use.

Explain again. Wax is the OUTSIDE of the link to look pretty.

The chain needs oil to penetrate into the space between the roller and the bushing. It also needs oil at the sprocket teeth as a cushion. This is why it is called a roller chain.

I can take an "O" ring chain. Center stand,start the engine,put in gear. As you spray the oil on the chain it noticebly frees up and gets quieter.

If the chain frees up and gets quiter as you spray, you waited too long to lube it Razz

I can see the oil vs wax perhaps having an impact if one used the conventional non-O ring chain. But o ring and x ring chains are sealed... and I don't know if you ever used it but wax is runny for a while but doesn't flick around like crazy. Or at least flicks around less. In addition, I don't spray the wax only in the middle of the rollers like I've witnessed some people do. I spray on one side of the chain aiming right in the between the roller and the link and then the same on the other side, and some on actual roller/sprocket contact.
Either way, I had used the wax on 3 bikes so far, never noticed any excessive wear nor binding or exploding chains. I like your spray bottle idea, but it's not really a thing you want to pack up for a 3k mile trip.
Maybe we're looking too far into a KISS procedure.

Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 11:13 am

sonicrete wrote:

I can take an "O" ring chain. Center stand,start the engine,put in gear. As you spray the oil on the chain it noticebly frees up and gets quieter.

I an do the same thing with the wax. But like Batan said if that happens then you are waiting to long to lube the chain. wax is way better than the oil / greese

Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 3:15 pm

Batan wrote:

I went for the X-ring and I use chain wax in a can. Wax does not drip and splatter like other lubes. The downside for some is that it's harder to see but I lube the chain religiously so that's not a problem.

+1
Chain wax is the shizzle. Spray it on, give it 10-15 minutes to set, no flinging of chain lube.

Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 4:31 pm

Yep, been using chain wax for years and haven't noticed any ill effects.

In any case, even if chain wax wasn't as good (and I fully believe that it is) as some other chain oil, when I remember the amount of effort required in the old days, cleaning all that shit off my rear rim, I'd rather change my chain and sprockets more often to avoid the clean up grief!

I'm still a big fan of shaft drives, not because of their inherent less frequent maintenance, but because there's never any mess to clean up.

Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 4:57 pm

Are you REALLY that stupid to not think I "waited" too long.

I oil chains constantly. I did it as a matter of service when I did the service checks at the Honda dealer ship my dad owned.

Now I will say this for the THIRD time.

The sealed chains only lube the space from the outer link "pin" to the inner link "bushing". If you do not understand this look it up to see how a chain is made.

The space from the ROLLER thus the name "roller chain",to the bushing is not sealed and needs oiled. The sprocket needs the cushion of the oil that becomes grease when the chain type lube converts. Chain lube is not oil,it sprays on "wet" then congeals into grease.

Like I said chain saw bar oil does not fling off like the cheap assed really expensive bike oil does.

Let's see if I can explain this easy. My parents were married on a bike,a 2500 mile honeymoon on a hard tail Harley. Duplicated it the next year. I was born the next. Mom rode till she was 6 months pregnant with me. They did not have a car. Mom brought home a variety of household items on a bike. A Chrismas tree,a 9X12 foot carpet,a set of dishes. I am 62 and grew up in a bike shop. Now someone is telling me WAX is chain lube. Wax is to shine up a lamp,not preserve moving parts.

Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 6:42 pm

sonicrete wrote:

. Now someone is telling me WAX is chain lube. Wax is to shine up a lamp,not preserve moving parts.

Yup that is what we are saying

http://www.kneedraggers.com/product/38-MAX-9/Maxima-Chain-Wax

Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2010 4:03 pm

The question on chains is dirt.

Oil + grit = grinding compound.

For dirty enviornments wax lubes are better than dry metal on dry metal and keep surface rust off the rollers and wax is not a magnet for dirt and grit.

Is wax preserving the metal surface and providing (a less efficient) lubrication worse than running oil that quickly turns to grinding compound?

I have tried Lubriplate chain lube which appears to be either Dry Graphite or Moly in a solvent based carrier that evaporates.

If I use an oily chain lube I like to oil, let sit and wipe off the excess.

I raced Cross country Mountain bikes locally for a few years and oil on the chain was a quick death which also took out front chain rings and the rear cluster ($$$$), Wax was the lube of choice (repelled some water) but some dry lubes were popular too.

You can use chain saw oil on your chain but you will be cleaning a sticky mess often unless you want dirt trapped in that sticky carrier grinding your chain and sprockets to bits.

Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2010 7:41 pm

You understand I can buy bar oil by the gallon so I DROUND the chain to wash off the dirt.

I wish you guys would listen to me from time to time since I have been doing this all my life.

Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2010 8:18 pm

sonicrete wrote:

You understand I can buy bar oil by the gallon so I DROUND the chain to wash off the dirt.

I wish you guys would listen to me from time to time since I have been doing this all my life.

Sounds like a big F`in mess too me things have changed since the 70`s

Posted: Sat Sep 18, 2010 8:45 pm

If you see an engine destroyed because some ass hole does not know what chain oil is but his wheel is clean,he deserved it.

There is an old story about Mortimer"s complaint. The story about a motorcycle shop and how "they" come in. A Ma Bell mystey,as in "it makes a funny noise". Case A is Ambulatory. Case B is the tense of the verb, "as in MADE a funny noise,then it stopped". Case C is when the indefinite "it" is definetly dead as in cardboard box. Then there was the Cosmetic Queen who bought wax by the case but never bought engine oil.

Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 2:56 am

sonicrete wrote:

If you see an engine destroyed because some ass hole does not know what chain oil is but his wheel is clean,he deserved it.

Are you referring to somebody not lubing their chain or somebody lubing the chain with chain wax?

Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:53 am

sonicrete wrote:

You understand I can buy bar oil by the gallon so I DROUND the chain to wash off the dirt.

I wish you guys would listen to me from time to time since I have been doing this all my life.

Is "dround" a motorcycle shop technical term?

A lot has changed over the years and there are a number of excellent modern chain lubes out there besides chainsaw bar oil. Even if you don't want to try it out, accept the fact that a motorcycle chain can be properly lubed and protected without making a huge oily mess of everything in proximity. If this stuff didn't work, motorcycle shops and dealers wouldn't stock it on their shelves.

Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:35 am

Do you guys actually not understand how many assholes I see? I have seen bikes with chains really rusty to hear,"It is an "O" ring so it does not need lubed".

I tell you so you argue,just fine. The chain oil in the fancy bottle DOES NOT STAY like chain and bar oil. I tried most of them before I got smart.

You spray the line of the chain links to get to the rollers. Let it set till the stuff gels up. It does not fly off.