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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2018 7:42 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Hi

I just put new sprockets and chain on the 1100.

The manual says 20mm slack with bike on center stand. This seems tight when I take bike off center stand and sit on it.

I have it ser at 40mm which just seems OK when I sit on the bike.

Cheers
Scott
 
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Hondo57
CB1100F
CB1100F



Joined: Jun 20, 2014
Posts: 2301
Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:18 am Reply with quote Back to top

That is a great question. I have always had the same problem so I just run it a hair loose. I do the adjustment by eye from the back as well. The chain runs very silent when properly lined up with the back sprocket but when it warms up it seems to have a lot more slack

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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:20 am Reply with quote Back to top

This is looking down the left hand side.
 
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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:25 am Reply with quote Back to top

And this is looking down the right hand side.

It looks like there is a gap to the right but not left.

Thanks dude. I normally use calipers to measure axle ti swing arm. But now I'll fine tune by eye and a torch.

Test ride soon. Have a good Friday night
Scott
 
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nlovie
Black CB750F
Black CB750F



Joined: May 30, 2015
Posts: 882
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 9:34 am Reply with quote Back to top

any signs of metal filings below the front sprocket -it does look like the sprockets are not aligned
could be sprocket spacing or it could be the rear axle isn't parallel to the swing arm pivot - either way i'd be fixing this
if the rear sprocket as a step on it ( typical after market steel sprocket) then turning it around might do the trick - otherwise a set of washers of appropriate thickness between the carrier the the sprocket would work
 
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toonces
Rest in Peace



Joined: Jun 29, 2004
Posts: 517
Location: littleton, massachusetts

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 1:29 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Motion Pro has a cheap tool that clamps to the rear sprocket, there's a rod attached
that you set parallel to the chain line.

chain tool

I find it much more accurate than calipers or the tick marks on the adjusters.

For chain slack, 40mm total slack sounds about right. You want to feel the minimum amount
of "take-up" when getting on & off the gas, but without ever going full tight.

Hope this helps,

Toonces
 
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Hondo57
CB1100F
CB1100F



Joined: Jun 20, 2014
Posts: 2301
Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 3:57 pm Reply with quote Back to top

The rear sprocket teeth need to be dead center on the rollers. Your picture looks a little off to one side. Could be a front sprocket issue? Normally when the rear sprocket is lined up and bolts tightened tight you should be able to spin the wheel by hand and it runs pretty quiet if oiled also. I am assuming you have the chain guard off and are looking at the way the chain rides on the rollers from a top and back view as well?

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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:51 pm Reply with quote Back to top

That's the bottom row of chain. I have the chain guard still on and I just managed to squeeze the phone into a position at the bottom of the rear sprocket to get a shot along the chain towards the front sprocket.
 
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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:56 pm Reply with quote Back to top

nlovie wrote:
any signs of metal filings below the front sprocket -it does look like the sprockets are not aligned
could be sprocket spacing or it could be the rear axle isn't parallel to the swing arm pivot - either way i'd be fixing this
if the rear sprocket as a step on it ( typical after market steel sprocket) then turning it around might do the trick - otherwise a set of washers of appropriate thickness between the carrier the the sprocket would work


The old front sprocket (this is a new one in the photo) didn't have any metal filings around the area, although the old sprocket shows signs of wear on the outside edge. The old sprocket also has a different offset and this new sprocket sits closer to the engine cases or it goes on the shaft further than the old one.

I think I will take the bike around the block and recheck
 
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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jan 19, 2018 6:59 pm Reply with quote Back to top

toonces wrote:
Motion Pro has a cheap tool that clamps to the rear sprocket, there's a rod attached
that you set parallel to the chain line.

chain tool

I find it much more accurate than calipers or the tick marks on the adjusters.

For chain slack, 40mm total slack sounds about right. You want to feel the minimum amount
of "take-up" when getting on & off the gas, but without ever going full tight.

Hope this helps,

Toonces


Definatly going to get a tool like that so I can be more accurate with my chains
 
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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 12:48 am Reply with quote Back to top

This is the sproket I took off.
 
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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 12:53 am Reply with quote Back to top

Another angle. This is the outside edge of the old front sproket. The new one sits further in on the splines but could probably go in a cock hair more or maybe space out the rear sprocket as nlovie said.
 
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Bucko
CB1100F
CB1100F



Joined: Dec 15, 2003
Posts: 2839
Location: Vancouver BC

PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:30 am Reply with quote Back to top

That wear pattern - I guess that wouldn't happen with an odd number of teeth??
 
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nlovie
Black CB750F
Black CB750F



Joined: May 30, 2015
Posts: 882
Location: United Kingdom

PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:52 am Reply with quote Back to top

seeing this wear I would also take a critical look at your chain - if it was me i'd be scrapping it Crying or Very sad if its a good one but it has been subjected to loading it wasn't designed for
 
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herdygerdy
Hawk
Hawk



Joined: Feb 27, 2007
Posts: 273
Location: Sydney, Australia

PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 4:58 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Hey Scott!

I would be carefully checking the old chain for witness marks of rubbing on the inside of the plates too. Your new set up does look like the front sprocket is over to the left too much and that will likely give similar wear marks to the old, while also being quite noisy, probably sap horsepower and another early replacement of the chain/sprocket set.

Take this with a grain of salt, but could it be possible to space out the rear sprocket slightly by putting shims behind the sprocket on each mounting stud. It would only need to come be space out 1/2 the distance from inside face of front sprocket to the inside surface of the side plates on the RH side of your chain - or as you say, about a "cock hair" Laughing

Or conversely, machine a relief circle from the inside face of the front sprocket slightly to move it closer to the crankcase if turning it around does not centre the sprocket teeth perfectly on the chain rollers.

Time spent getting this right will be rewarded with quiet running and long life.

Keep smiling buddy.

Cheers...Tony
 
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SteveG
Silver CB900F
Silver CB900F



Joined: Apr 07, 2006
Posts: 1552
Location: Skaneateles, NY

PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:38 pm Reply with quote Back to top

If the two sprockets are so offset that it wears the front sprocket as shown in the picture, then shouldn't the rear sprocket have similar wear on the opposite (wheel) side?

Either the front sprocket is to far "left" or the rear sprocket to far "right", which could also be from the wheel/tire not being centered in the swingarm/centerline of the bike.

Steve

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\'79 CB750(810)F, \'81 CB900(985)F, \'82 CB900(Going to be 1100)F, \'82 CBX, \'06 WeeStrom, \'22 CanAm Ryker Rally 
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headless
CB1100F
CB1100F



Joined: Sep 03, 2008
Posts: 2041
Location: Eugene, OR

PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2018 8:31 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Bucko wrote:
That wear pattern - I guess that wouldn't happen with an odd number of teeth??


+1. You can use gearingcommander.com to calculate a 'Same tooth - same link' situation.

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Cary 
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DrOlds
Silver CB900F
Silver CB900F



Joined: Feb 23, 2008
Posts: 1234
Location: Watertown NY USA

PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:06 pm Reply with quote Back to top

The chain & sprockets became worn on my original 1100F and I noted the slack was extremely different between the rear wheel hanging down (bike on the center stand) and fully weighted (two people on the seat). It was way to loose hanging free and way to tight with the suspension compressed.

I put a new chain and two new JT sprockets (stock teeth) and it is the same compressed or hanging.

FYI if you go to the Dennis Kirk website there is no suggested 530 chain for the 1100F. I called the technical department and they said they do not recommend a 530 chain for our bike because there is not one strong enough. The suggested the Tsubaki Sigma Gold chain which I bought. I believe I have adjusted it about every other year. (I also put one on "Junior:" my 1100F powered F2 converted bike and on my 1985 VF1000R. By the best / replace the sprockets, make sure they line up (the laser line up gauges are nice) then forget about it.

http://www.chaparral-racing.com/product/tsubaki-530-sigma-hi-performance-o-ring-chain/262-2021.aspx

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It is not death that a man should fear, but he should fear never beginning to live.
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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:15 pm Reply with quote Back to top

nlovie wrote:
seeing this wear I would also take a critical look at your chain - if it was me i'd be scrapping it Crying or Very sad if its a good one but it has been subjected to loading it wasn't designed for


The old chain is in the bin.

The only thing I kept is the 38T rear that was on the bike for a test before I went for the 36T rear.
 
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Hondo57
CB1100F
CB1100F



Joined: Jun 20, 2014
Posts: 2301
Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan

PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:16 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I used Tsubaki chain and sunstar sprockets for a lot of years. They are not easy to come by anymore except online so I have been using DID and JT sprockets. Really haven't had much of a complaint? The adjustment is the hardest part as you said with the compression and then hanging free. Guess I am just not so obsessed by it anymore and it is always a bit loose but not too much.

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Greg

Last edited by Hondo57 on Mon Jan 22, 2018 12:32 am; edited 1 time in total 
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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:20 pm Reply with quote Back to top

herdygerdy wrote:
Hey Scott!

I would be carefully checking the old chain for witness marks of rubbing on the inside of the plates too. Your new set up does look like the front sprocket is over to the left too much and that will likely give similar wear marks to the old, while also being quite noisy, probably sap horsepower and another early replacement of the chain/sprocket set.

Take this with a grain of salt, but could it be possible to space out the rear sprocket slightly by putting shims behind the sprocket on each mounting stud. It would only need to come be space out 1/2 the distance from inside face of front sprocket to the inside surface of the side plates on the RH side of your chain - or as you say, about a "cock hair" Laughing

Or conversely, machine a relief circle from the inside face of the front sprocket slightly to move it closer to the crankcase if turning it around does not centre the sprocket teeth perfectly on the chain rollers.

Time spent getting this right will be rewarded with quiet running and long life.

Keep smiling buddy.

G'day Tony

Probably moving the front sprocket over would be easy enough, but I just ran out of time over the weekend and now I'm thinking of taking it to Philip Island tomorrow so we'll see what happens.

Cheers...Tony
 
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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:32 pm Reply with quote Back to top

SteveG wrote:
If the two sprockets are so offset that it wears the front sprocket as shown in the picture, then shouldn't the rear sprocket have similar wear on the opposite (wheel) side?

Either the front sprocket is to far "left" or the rear sprocket to far "right", which could also be from the wheel/tire not being centered in the swingarm/centerline of the bike.

Steve


G'day Steve

The old rear sprocket didn't appear to have any wear marks on the inside.

The new set up has the chain pretty much centered on the rear.
 
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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:36 pm Reply with quote Back to top

It is hard to show accurately in a photo, but when you spin the rear wheel and check the chain on the sprocket it looks better than what the photo makes it look.

I did also have a mate look to see what he thought but I will double check it when I get home from work.

Scott
 
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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:40 pm Reply with quote Back to top

DrOlds wrote:
The chain & sprockets became worn on my original 1100F and I noted the slack was extremely different between the rear wheel hanging down (bike on the center stand) and fully weighted (two people on the seat). It was way to loose hanging free and way to tight with the suspension compressed.

I put a new chain and two new JT sprockets (stock teeth) and it is the same compressed or hanging.

FYI if you go to the Dennis Kirk website there is no suggested 530 chain for the 1100F. I called the technical department and they said they do not recommend a 530 chain for our bike because there is not one strong enough. The suggested the Tsubaki Sigma Gold chain which I bought. I believe I have adjusted it about every other year. (I also put one on "Junior:" my 1100F powered F2 converted bike and on my 1985 VF1000R. By the best / replace the sprockets, make sure they line up (the laser line up gauges are nice) then forget about it.

http://www.chaparral-racing.com/product/tsubaki-530-sigma-hi-performance-o-ring-chain/262-2021.aspx


Nice bit of info

Thanks I'll keep it in mind for sure. I did buy a cheeper option this time due to time restraints so maybe next time I will plan ahead like maybe latter this year and have the "good stuff" on the shelf waiting
 
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scottx
Silver CB750F
Silver CB750F



Joined: May 15, 2012
Posts: 733
Location: Sydney Australia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 5:43 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Hondo57 wrote:
I used Tsubaki chain and sunstar sprockets for a lot of years. They are not easy to come by anymore except online so I have been using JT. Really haven't had much of a complaint? The adjustment is the hardest part as you said with the compression and then hanging free. Guess I am just not so obsessed by it anymore and it is always a bit loose but not too much.


That's what I've done. I've left it a bit loose compared to what the manual says and I'm sure it will be OK for now, but I will check it before the next few rides.
 
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Bucko
CB1100F
CB1100F



Joined: Dec 15, 2003
Posts: 2839
Location: Vancouver BC

PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:31 pm Reply with quote Back to top

DrOlds wrote:
I called the technical department and they said they do not recommend a 530 chain for our bike because there is not one strong enough.


What? I suspect the correct answer is: Dennis Kirk may not sell one strong enough.
 
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toonces
Rest in Peace



Joined: Jun 29, 2004
Posts: 517
Location: littleton, massachusetts

PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2018 11:23 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Here's a nice chain at a reasonable price:

EK Chain

I've used several of these, presently installed on both bikes, they work great and last a long time with reasonable care.

Couple them with Sunstar Sprockets and make sure they're running straight, you'll be good for 25,000+ miles.

Toonces
 
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